Fighting the camping with automated, lethal gas (or something else)!

[TheBlackshot]

I won't be able to present you my idea optimally, still the content is there.

The camping issue has been addressed several times, the most common suggestion against camping was redesigning the maps and spots. The developers have already implemented the timer to stop games from lenghtening into eternity. However that's no real fix for camping.
Now I don't know how I got this idea (lowkey hoping it wasn't Battle Royale) but I thought that campers who e.g. stay at the same area (important: area, not just standing still like AFK) for 7 seconds at once, activate some gas that slowly kills you (much slower than level 1 fire) for that limited area. The gas shall be removed in a short time however only when no player- or the same player who activated it, does not enter that area.
Gas was a spontaneous thought of mine. It could also be a Turret... or enemy bots that come out of nowhere.
I know it's a pretty ambitious idea for many maps, especially to include on nearly every spot. We could make this work only on certain spots, the most campable and boring ones, such as the litte tracts left and right on The Pit. Stay there for too long and you'll have a reason to come out.

Edit: I've thought of one more thing. Increasing weapon spawns (weapons that arent a pipe wrench) elsewhere on the map for the non-camper to make use of against the camper.

[RickAvory]

Eh. If you want to stop someone from “camping”, throw a Molotov at them. Works most of the time.

[StarNord]

I don't think that SFD really has that big of a problem with camping, but if there are certain areas that are more "campy" than others, I don't think an unorthodox solution like lethal gas would be appropriate, since the devs are taking the game in a "chaos over skill" direction, I think the most appropriate solution would be to simply make such areas destructible.

On top of that, there are many weapons capable of forcing enemies out of these camp-spots, like grenades, molotovs, other explosive weapons, and to top it all off, simply the existence of the throwing mechanic.

[mgtr14]

I don't think that SFD really has that big of a problem with camping, but if there are certain areas that are more "campy" than others, I don't think an unorthodox solution like lethal gas would be appropriate, since the devs are taking the game in a "chaos over skill" direction, I think the most appropriate solution would be to simply make such areas destructible.

On top of that, there are many weapons capable of forcing enemies out of these camp-spots, like grenades, molotovs, other explosive weapons, and to top it all off, simply the existence of the throwing mechanic.

Eh. If you want to stop someone from “camping”, throw a Molotov at them. Works most of the time.

Simply throwing anything at the campers is usually not good enough, or sometimes not even possible. If someone is camping on the top left of steamship, you would have to be in their firing range before you can throw anything at them. And even if you threw something, it probably wouldn't hit. If it's a grenade, it can be kicked away (Because it won't be cooked so long since you can't stand infront of them for that long).
If it's a molotov, you can just roll in place until the fires are out. The molotov-er can then move in and force you out a bit, but it would just become a normal gunfight/melee fight.

So for spots that aren't so easily guarded.. The camper knows when a grenade or molotov is coming, so he can get out of the way. Usually, there is somewhere to retreat and camp again.

And some spots are an endless cat-and-mouse chase, where you can chase them round and around forever.

But, I don't think the new mechanic should be added yet. I think that first, we should remake maps. It's usually the maps fault that people can camp so easily. That's why the official maps suck. Can someone just try making a map with multiple ways around?

[RickAvory]

Eh. If you want to stop someone from “camping”, throw a Molotov at them. Works most of the time.

Simply throwing anything at the campers is usually not good enough, or sometimes not even possible. If someone is camping on the top left of steamship, you would have to be in their firing range before you can throw anything at them. And even if you threw something, it probably wouldn't hit. If it's a grenade, it can be kicked away (Because it won't be cooked so long since you can't stand infront of them for that long).
If it's a molotov, you can just roll in place until the fires are out. The molotov-er can then move in and force you out a bit, but it would just become a normal gunfight/melee

Think about it. If you throw a grenade at the camper, what does the camper have to do... kick it or get it out of the way somehow, which ultimately results them getting out of cover. Perfect time to rush them.

If you throw a Molotov, what does the camper have to do...roll. Especially when u get a direct hit on them. When they are on fire there main priority is to roll, not shoot you. Perfect time to rush them. You mentioned “it would just become a normal gunfight/melee” what the heck is wrong with a normal gunfight or melee? Isn’t that what we want? I mean that’s what the game is about after all.

[mgtr14]

Eh. If you want to stop someone from “camping”, throw a Molotov at them. Works most of the time.

Simply throwing anything at the campers is usually not good enough, or sometimes not even possible. If someone is camping on the top left of steamship, you would have to be in their firing range before you can throw anything at them. And even if you threw something, it probably wouldn't hit. If it's a grenade, it can be kicked away (Because it won't be cooked so long since you can't stand infront of them for that long).
If it's a molotov, you can just roll in place until the fires are out. The molotov-er can then move in and force you out a bit, but it would just become a normal gunfight/melee

Think about it. If you throw a grenade at the camper, what does the camper have to do... kick it or get it out of the way somehow, which ultimately results them getting out of cover. Perfect time to rush them.

If you throw a Molotov, what does the camper have to do...roll. Especially when u get a direct hit on them. When they are on fire there main priority is to roll, not shoot you. Perfect time to rush them. You mentioned “it would just become a normal gunfight/melee” what the heck is wrong with a normal gunfight or melee? Isn’t that what we want? I mean that’s what the game is about after all.

The camper retreats. That's not much to go on, unless you can also hit him while he's diving away. He may even already get up as soon as you brandish grenades, so he can shoot you instead. Or retreat.

"It just becomes a normal fight" is that the campers aren't really punished. You need grenades or molotovs, or something else that can potentially flush them out, only to make them run or go back to fighting. Took some effort from your side, only to be nullified, or get you to a point that IMO shouldn't take that much.

[RickAvory]

Think about it. If you throw a grenade at the camper, what does the camper have to do... kick it or get it out of the way somehow, which ultimately results them getting out of cover. Perfect time to rush them.

If you throw a Molotov, what does the camper have to do...roll. Especially when u get a direct hit on them. When they are on fire there main priority is to roll, not shoot you. Perfect time to rush them. You mentioned “it would just become a normal gunfight/melee” what the heck is wrong with a normal gunfight or melee? Isn’t that what we want? I mean that’s what the game is about after all.

The camper retreats. That's not much to go on, unless you can also hit him while he's diving away. He may even retreat while you take out your grenades, so he can shoot you instead. Or keep running away.

"It just becomes a normal fight" is that the campers aren't really punished. You need grenades or molotovs, or something else that can potentially flush them out, only to make them run or go back to fighting. Took some effort from your side, only to be nullified, or get you to a point that IMO shouldn't take that much.

And that’s a problem why? If the guy wants to play like that, that’s his choice. If someone wants to spam grab, spam the a button, or run around like a loon, that’s his choice. We have methods of dealing with them. Chances are we all used these tactics at some point in time right? I see absolutely no issue with the current way campers are handled.

[mgtr14]

Think about it. If you throw a grenade at the camper, what does the camper have to do... kick it or get it out of the way somehow, which ultimately results them getting out of cover. Perfect time to rush them.

If you throw a Molotov, what does the camper have to do...roll. Especially when u get a direct hit on them. When they are on fire there main priority is to roll, not shoot you. Perfect time to rush them. You mentioned “it would just become a normal gunfight/melee” what the heck is wrong with a normal gunfight or melee? Isn’t that what we want? I mean that’s what the game is about after all.

The camper retreats. That's not much to go on, unless you can also hit him while he's diving away. He may even retreat while you take out your grenades, so he can shoot you instead. Or keep running away.

"It just becomes a normal fight" is that the campers aren't really punished. You need grenades or molotovs, or something else that can potentially flush them out, only to make them run or go back to fighting. Took some effort from your side, only to be nullified, or get you to a point that IMO shouldn't take that much.

And that’s a problem why? If the guy wants to play like that, that’s his choice. If someone wants to spam grab, spam the a button, or run around like a loon, that’s his choice. We have methods of dealing with them. Chances are we all used these tactics at some point in time right? I see absolutely no issue with the current way campers are handled.

Camping slows the game down and is not fun to fight against. It is very easy to nullify any efforts to flush them out. That's why it's a problem. I don't care that someone wants to camp, I care that it's a very overpowered and boring tactic to use.

[RickAvory]

The camper retreats. That's not much to go on, unless you can also hit him while he's diving away. He may even retreat while you take out your grenades, so he can shoot you instead. Or keep running away.

"It just becomes a normal fight" is that the campers aren't really punished. You need grenades or molotovs, or something else that can potentially flush them out, only to make them run or go back to fighting. Took some effort from your side, only to be nullified, or get you to a point that IMO shouldn't take that much.

And that’s a problem why? If the guy wants to play like that, that’s his choice. If someone wants to spam grab, spam the a button, or run around like a loon, that’s his choice. We have methods of dealing with them. Chances are we all used these tactics at some point in time right? I see absolutely no issue with the current way campers are handled.

Camping slows the game down and is not fun to fight against. It is very easy to nullify any efforts to flush you out. That's why it's a problem. I don't care that someone wants to camp, I care that it's a very overpowered and boring tactic to use.

And that’s your opinion. I agree with you to an extent, however there are current ways that are efficient enough to deal with them. There was another post where someone was mentioning the impairing of the strong instead of benifiting the weak. This is the same situation here. If you give me a feature where the “weak” (non camper) can oust the “strong” camper, then maybe I will be on board.

[mgtr14]

And that’s a problem why? If the guy wants to play like that, that’s his choice. If someone wants to spam grab, spam the a button, or run around like a loon, that’s his choice. We have methods of dealing with them. Chances are we all used these tactics at some point in time right? I see absolutely no issue with the current way campers are handled.

Camping slows the game down and is not fun to fight against. It is very easy to nullify any efforts to flush you out. That's why it's a problem. I don't care that someone wants to camp, I care that it's a very overpowered and boring tactic to use.

And that’s your opinion. I agree with you to an extent, however there are current ways that are efficient enough to deal with them. There was another post where someone was mentioning the impairing of the strong instead of benifiting the weak. This is the same situation here. If you give me a feature where the “weak” (non camper) can oust the “strong” camper, then maybe I will be on board.

The only thing that was an opinion was that it's not fun to fight against. And it usually isn't, because they can easily nullify your efforts. I wouldn't be surprised if most people thinks it's too hard to get to a camper.
You say that there are "efficient" ways to deal with them... after I said that they can easily nullify your efforts, by retreating or attacking you when you try to throw anything.

Is there any way to either make it easier to flush out campers or to mitigate camping? As I said, I think part of the solution is better map making. You can make camping spots deadly by simply making it a dead end, so the camper can't retreat from grenades or molotovs. Or you can make it easier to be in range of potential camping spots, etc.

[RickAvory]

I don't think that SFD really has that big of a problem with camping, but if there are certain areas that are more "campy" than others, I don't think an unorthodox solution like lethal gas would be appropriate, since the devs are taking the game in a "chaos over skill" direction, I think the most appropriate solution would be to simply make such areas destructible.

On top of that, there are many weapons capable of forcing enemies out of these camp-spots, like grenades, molotovs, other explosive weapons, and to top it all off, simply the existence of the throwing mechanic.

@mgtr14 I think this idea is perfect. Enables the weak instead of disabling the strong. Better map design as you said.

[StarNord]

On top of that, there are many weapons capable of forcing enemies out of these camp-spots, like grenades, molotovs, other explosive weapons, and to top it all off, simply the existence of the throwing mechanic.

Forgot to mention the slo-mo, if used correctly it allows you to pretty easily tell what the camper is gonna try next, but if you lack basic anticipation skills, and if you've got a melee weapon you just can block incoming shots with the help of slo-mo and rush em', and the best thing is, slo-mo ain't that hard to come by.

But if what we have doesn't work, I'm sure there's a suggestion out there that could possibly solve this problem. please give me attention...

Is there any way to either make it easier to flush out campers or to mitigate camping? As I said, I think part of the solution is better map making. You can make camping spots deadly by simply making it a dead end, so the camper can't retreat from grenades or molotovs. Or you can make it easier to be in range of potential camping spots, etc.

It's sad we have to resort to custom maps for this sorta thing, maybe a certain someone should, instead of posting their changes independently, propose their custom map as a possible change for the game's official maps.

@Lunatic drop a screenshot of your crappy custom maps on ideas and suggestions and propose them as a possible change for the official maps, they're unpopular in SFD anyways...

This might make the more talented mapmakers to come out with their better edits that'll more easily sell the idea of community official map edits.

Make a difference, will ya? before we do it ourselves and take all the credit

[Gurt]

I made a script some time ago (just uploaded it) that spawns a mine at your position if you linger at the same spot for too long.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/ ... 1581028493

Might be something for you.

[TheBlackshot]

I made a script some time ago (just uploaded it) that spawns a mine at your position if you linger at the same spot for too long.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/ ... 1581028493

Might be something for you.

it's very simple and not as funky as my idea but its a start, thanks

It's sad we have to resort to custom maps for this sorta thing

For the very most part I am fine with the way official maps are, I'd rather add new features that moderate all problems left. Having created some official type maps myself (Outskirts Industry my baby) made me fathom what works and what creates new complications. I liked @Lunatic's changes (that steamship platform is essential) regardless.